Outlander S7E9 - Fandom Hybrid Podcast #322

0:25 What's up, hybrids? Welcome back to another episode of the Phantom Hybrid Podcast. This is Hanukkah and I'm here with Michelle and we are discussing the return of Outlander Season 7 Episode 9. Drought Lander is over. Yes, yes, yes. Finally, and we are back in Scotland. But this episode here. You ain't even gonna give me a minute. How do you feel about this episode, Michelle? It was great. I mean, the reunion was great, but all the other stuff in between? You mean in between you look you.

1:07 You mean from the beginning of the episode? You start the episode with Simon Fraser's funeral. Then when Ian reunites with his family he sees his brothers. One of his brothers is there from France and he's like did you bring your wife? No, she died 2 weeks ago from influenza. And then Dan? And then you find out that Big Ian has consumption and has been sick. And the crazy thing is, when Claire asks Jenny how long he's had the cough, she said. You remember when it came back from the toll booth? Never. It never went away. What that's? A long time.

1:50 That's a long time that was wow. Claire was gone when they were searching for the dumb bonding so and when I say they do look he looked like horrible like. But I still had some fight in him 'cause he he was able to walk in and out when he left. So I completely enjoyed it. But that's yes, but that was. You weren't prepared for that. I wasn't either. I was like. No, 'cause I, I was wondering like, why, why didn't they come out? But now I know and something is so sad because Ian, them looking at him, that's the last time they're gonna see him. So that's like, that was horrible.

2:32 But I'm glad we got this time. Yeah. And I know. And I love that it was a good time for Jamie to come back because Jenny needed that, A reminder of who she is and what she has accomplished. Yeah. So when Ian goes, she can get back on track. But when I tell you when I read this in the books, I was like, so you mean when when the show comes back, you mean that we're going back to Scotland just to be with Ian for however long he has? And I was so mad when I read it because I was like my Ian, my Ian. But y'all couldn't let let now let. Me.

3:21 Let me let. Me not, let me not say that, but because I don't want to wish death on her character. She was just, she was just horrible. But she wasn't, she wasn't a Rob camera so. Oh no. And it and to be completely honest, Leary had her false, but you got to kind of see the time period and what was happening. And she really thought that somehow in the beginning, beginning, Jamie had feelings. For her, which she wasn't wrong about as far as you know, thinking that because Jamie. Was using her right so to make Claire jealous, right? And then later when she gets with them and stuff, she thought that would change things and that just didn't. OK, so this is the this is the part that kind of bothers me about the way that they're telling the story in the show as opposed to the books, because it kind of it makes it seem like Jamie just didn't try with Leary. And I think that that was.

4:24 I don't think he I didn't feel like he didn't in the show. Well, go, if you go by what she says in the argument that she has with him in this episode, she's like, you never saw me, you know, you just pitied me, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. And if you remember when Jamie was first telling Claire about the marriage and about what, you know, what made him marry her and stuff, you know, he talks about how he could never be intimate with her because she was shy away from him. So in the books, if I remember correctly, because it has been a few years since I've read that particular part of the books when he talks about his marriage to Leary.

5:06 So when they get married in the books, yes, he marries her mostly for the kids, but he's like, OK, well, I'm going to try to, you know, make this work, blah, blah, blah. And he does try to be a good husband to her. He tries to be intimate with her. But like he said in the show as well, she was always very sullen with him. She was very angry. There were days when she would not, just would not speak to him. And we all know Jamie. Jamie is one of those people. He is very big on communication with his wife. He's very affectionate. He's very, he's very much a sexual being. He's very much a physical being. So he moved out because he didn't want to feel like he was trying to force himself on her when she very clearly didn't want him.

5:52 So in the books, I can't remember if this is while they were actually married or afterwards. There was a there was a scene where he comes back to the house, he's outside the house and he hears like this kind of guttural grown like this, whatever, kind of like he, he describes it in the book, I believe it's like animalistic in nature. And he happens to look in the window and Leary is in the house having this like really, really rough sex with some guy. I don't know. I don't think it was the same guy that she is involved with here in the show. But it was one of those things where he he was angry about it because he was like, I tried to be a good husband. I tried to be a loving husband.

6:42 He knew that her first two marriages were rough on her. You know, she had husbands who beat her, beat the kids, had husbands who were not gentle with her in that in that physical sense. And he was just trying to be a good husband to her. And he was like, if this is what she want, like, like she pursued me for years. She wanted me for all this time. She damn, they care about killed my wife trying to get to me. And then when she finally has me, she doesn't even want me. But then she goes and she's with this. Like, he was really pissed about it in the books. Like it hurt his pride. It hurt his, you know, his manhood. And so when Claire is jesting with him at the beginning of this episode, when he tells her he's going to see Lyra, she was like, well, you know, if you just want to know who she's sleeping with, there's other ways to find out.

7:27 It felt out of place to me because you don't know what that background is, you know? But other than that, there weren't too many things that I didn't like about the. Episode now go back because we were talking about in the book you were like he tried but in the episodes on the show I felt that he did try with her. Yeah, but but I did her. Her perspective and sense of reality was just off. And she felt wounded that he made a choice. Yeah. And that choice was clear. And even though she still had, she got him in the not at the end, but at that point she got him. He still wasn't hers. Yeah, but you know what?

8:11 And I would say this, and again, this is attitudes. In this time. Yeah, attitudes in this time and also the wait because everybody falls in love so quickly in the in in the 1700s. But if you knew like as much as he went through with Claire, even in the beginning when they came back to LYAC and he made it clear that, yeah, I'm, I'm going to stick with her. This is my wife. I want to be with her for you to keep trying over and over to get with this man. I'm sorry if I don't want to say she got what she deserved, but stop.

8:53 Stop fawning and stop trying to get a man. But she still kind of thought he did in the beginning. It's still this episode when she asking him. So you really didn't care? Okay, and again, this goes back to all these people catching feelings when he took that beating for her, she said I thought you did it because you loved me. But she knew even before then, like he didn't really pay attention to her. Right. But but you would think that he was being shy. So I'm saying like people would be thinking. So like for example, let's say Ian Rachel has the dog. Clearly they kiss, but he still hadn't really confessed his feelings.

9:39 He left his dog right. I'm just using this example. So but if he turned around and came back with a wife, she'd be like, well, I mean, you wasn't direct, but I just assume and that's like, well, maybe he was shy, maybe I feel. But when he took that beating, he was actually confessing his love. I'm just trying to help her out. OK, we can move on. We don't need to help her. Out we can. You don't need to help. But you know, it's it's over now. Yes, yeah, that's over. And she marrying her Boo. Yes, and he's finally done with her because we'll talk about the knocks on the door. But Joni appears and talks to him because she wants to go into the convent.

10:24 She wants to become a nun, and Leary is withholding her dowry so that she can't go. And I'm like, Leary, OK, you know what? This is the one thing I don't like about Leary's character. And I understand. Again, it's the times. Whatever. But you are literally holding off on your own happiness because of money. And land well, because she's been on that land. For years. But here's the thing, if that's what it was, you could have talked all this stuff, all this talk about the alimony and you haven't been sending me the money and blah blah blah. If he was holding bow rigging and trusty ship and that was her main thing, she could have just said, you know what, give me bow rigging and all bets are off. I can do whatever I need to do, but. She wasn't going to do that.

11:10 She wasn't going to do. That but. 'Cause he couldn't even figure that out. It had to be Jamie, Joni had to say. You can come up with a solution, wink, wink. I don't. Think Jamie I. Don't even thought about it. And that's. The problem too he. Wasn't thinking about it 'cause he was just like. Send money. I mean, she got the land, I'll send the money. No, you need to finalize these things. Like she is in the holding place. I'm going to be on her side on this one, OK? Because she does love Joey the farmer. However, if we get married, then we don't have a place to to live. I've been here years.

11:55 And I get that, but that's why now. And and this man has so no interest of either saying it's over. Here's the land like nothing. So she doesn't know what he is thinking. So she's like, well, I'm just going to keep doing what I'm going to do. However, Jamie should have realized, but you know what? He didn't realize 'cause he really don't care. It took the funeral for him to realize, well, maybe I need to go apologize and close this. Yeah, part of my life. Because I mean, he's been so far removed from it, but also he could have been just making. And you acting like she don't talk to Marsley. Right, but no. But I'm thinking the reason why he may have kept bow rigging in his trusty ship was to make sure that she didn't do any, you know, 'cause she probably could have if he knew. If he let me, let me.

12:46 He didn't even try it. I don't even think it's that it. I think he probably kept holding on to it to make sure it will be there for Joni and Marsley if they ever wanted to go back. Maybe that's where his he could. Have put that in, Rodney. But you know what? He's been busy, but he. Didn't think, but you know what? And at the and at the time, he was just trying to get, he was just trying to make that annulment go through so he could live his happy life. And they they. Think about it, they had not thought about her one be it you know when he when it comes to mine, sometimes sometimes when Marcy turn to serve way he'd be right. Man, I, I think I do need to take care of some of these. And then it goes away and he and then they back dealing with the issues that they got in here.

13:35 Like, that's really probably the only time he thought about it. And he came home and he was like. Let me go. Close. It closes. Think about this a few years. Ago and for all right so yeah he got her out of his his life now he gave her bow rigging told her that you know you go get married you can have this house but he did make he did when you die when you die it does not go to your husband he's. Back there like Joy the father like I'll shit with that. I just want to manage exactly take care of me exactly I'm. Good and Joni is going to go to the convent. He's like, go to. Right now I will say this about about them coming back to Scotland.

14:20 I love that they got back as many of the original actors as they could. Like we know they they had to re catch Jenny, but it was OK. I was really worried about like how I was going to feel about this new person being Jenny because she was such a force in the few episodes that we we got to see her and know her and love her. But yeah, I, I think this new actress, Kristen is her name. I think she's going to be good. Yeah, and you know what helped that they older. Yes. So then you could be like, oh, it's a change in her 'cause like he has grandkids. I can spend some time so I can.

15:03 My brain made the quick adjustment. What it did make adjustment for was damn, your siblings are old. I was like, wait a second. You mean Ian's siblings? Yeah. You have to remember he's also, he's also the baby. And no. And that was like, oh, it's good about them. Right. Or the he's the youngest son. I can't remember if he's the youngest. He's the youngest son. Kid, kid. But yeah, they're all like, grown and yeah, grandchildren and. A lot of grandkids. Yeah, because I think even when Claire came back after the 20 years, when she was in the house, Jenny was holding one of Michael's newest babies and she was telling she was saying that he had four at that time. Yeah, so he was already grown and and procreating and everything so that.

15:56 Threw me off. Even Ian was like, hey, what, Michael? Yeah, OK, yeah. But yeah, OK. So so let's talk about this home going a little bit because even like you said, even though Ian is sick and I think I said this when we're watching, I said how y'all made finance Stephen Creed look like he was a minute from a minute from death's door. Just I was like, are we gonna see him die in this episode? Because that I would not be ready for. I thought it was gonna happen so. And we, we at least get him for one more episode at least. But you know, I don't know how long they're gonna keep Jamie in Scotland because Claire does have to go back and Jamie stays behind.

16:45 But we'll, we'll get to that as well. But just seeing the old family, seeing Jamie and Claire be with the Murray's again, seeing ON have his sense of humor when they're talking about, you know, his impending sickness. And he was like, look, I could be dead tomorrow. I could be dead in a year, I'll wager 3 months myself. And Jamie was like, how would you, how you going to collect your old coop? And I was like, OK, I like this. I'm one of those people. I don't like the, the, the dread and drum that come the, the dread and drum. I don't like the dread and doom that comes with death.

17:30 Storylines are just death in general. I'm one of those people. Like when people have weird sense of humor or dark sense of humor when it comes to facing their own mortality. That's kind of my speed anyway. So to see him still be in those kinds of like, you know, every time we've seen Ian and Jamie, they've always gone back and forth. Jamie being serious and Ian being the one that's kind of cracking jokes. So to see that with this, I loved it. I love the fact that Claire finally, finally told. Them. Yeah, that was nice, that. She is from the future and I love the look that they had 'cause you see, when she's facing them, she's telling Michael, Ian and Jenny. I don't think she told any of the other kids, but they're all sitting there looking at her life. Huh.

18:25 And but Jenny Brain starts moving. And ends too cause Engle was just sitting there. Like this makes some sense here. Yeah, this really explains why you didn't come back to my brother for 20 years, because she, that was one of the things she said bothered her the most. She said, I remember sitting on these stairs when the Red Coats took him and you, she said we went to go look for him. You didn't. I mean, she literally crossed the whole countryside looking for James. So it all, it never sat right with Jenny. That Claire just, oh, I just assumed he was dead and I'm not going to come back. Yeah, and not even even go to the house and be like, you know, he's dead.

19:05 Can I grieve here? Yeah. And you are gone. Gone. Gone so. That explains it. Yeah. So I'm, I'm glad that they know now because I think it makes it, it makes it easier because now Jenny can stop being so suspicious of her when she tells her to do something. I mean, she wasn't as suspicious back then, but you know, Jenny, Jenny, OK. Jamie said this to Claire when he was joking about going to Lyrias. He was like, Claire. You're not usually one to go hold a grudge. Jenny absolutely does. And Jenny been mad at Claire for a lot of reasons for a lot for a long.

19:46 Time And Claire was actually mad at her too. Yeah, she was like, you've been holding the grudge. Like you've been holding the grudge because I told you about his name. Claire's like I. Don't care, really care. I mean, we've been together the last 10 years now. I don't care. I don't care Like this is Claire is very secure in her marriage. She's very secure with where she is in the world. And she, no, Larry, don't hold the candle to her. Sorry, Larry, you don't. So that was just a momentary hiccup. But also, if we remember correctly, Jamie was just about to tell Claire about the marriage when the kids bust in. So it's not like he wasn't going to do it. But this is a woman you have not seen for 20 years, somebody that you thought was dead.

20:38 The first thing you going to say is not going to be. Oh, yeah, I have another. What? No, because you don't know what this is about to be. I mean. And even during that reunion, he was like, so Art, did you just come back to bring me news of my daughter or are you planning on staying like. Yeah, like, what is this right? Yeah, well, for that long she could have fell in love with someone else. But she could have been like, oh, I'm going to come and give you. I'm going to come and give you news of your daughter. And then I'm going back to the 20th century. So he was probably like, look, let me hit it while I it's. Claire. Wait, Claire's not going to hold a grudge about that?

21:18 And not to Jenny, of all people, because she, I mean, if you think about it, she understood what Jenny was doing. Jenny was trying to make sure that Jamie stayed righteous, that Jamie did what he was supposed to do. And she also, let's, let's be honest, she was trying to get the truth. She was trying to figure out where Claire had been. And she probably used that opportunity to try to force the truth out of her. But Claire, Claire is not going to hold a grudge for that. And I'm glad that at the end, she finally realized that she was like, I trust in your love for our family. Yes, 'cause Claire has loved your family from day one. I think Claire understood that she was just really talking out for Greece. She just don't want Ian to die. And then you find out this woman to be magical, you're not really quite sure they can give you the quite all the details.

22:03 She just has knowledge. You just like please help him. And like Claire said, and I'm mad that she can't help him. You think Claire's not mad? She. Can't. But you know, that's what I'm saying. So at the end she apologized because she knew, you know, it was just me. Just saying I just don't want my man to die. Yeah, because you see how long you know, how long she's loved them because let's get. To. That Let's get to these parts. So yes. So while Claire is sitting there telling them that she's from the future, there's a knock at the door. And at the same time, Rodger and Buck have arrived in Scotland. OK, they've arrived in Scotland. They're looking for Rob and Jimmy. They decide to split up.

22:46 Buck is going to go to Inverness and see and Roger tells him he was like, well Jimmy knows these stones because I've I've brought him here before so he wouldn't be caught unawares. He knows how to get home from the stones. So if he was able to get away from Rob Cameron, maybe he went back to Lolly Brock. So Roger heads towards Lolly Brock. Now. Now I already knew what was going to happen because I read the books. I was finally Michelle was like. Wait the same time. Are they going to say are they? Going to knock on the door. Oh my God, this will be perfect. I was ready. I was ready, but in the back of my mind and it was misdirection because they're having it all at the same time and I'm like, this is going to be helping.

23:33 Fantastic. We going to get the whole family help here and they get to meet Roger, but it's staying and Joni. Johnny was on at at Jamie's door, and the door that Roger knocked on was still. Molly Brock. But it is Jamie's dad and I'm telling y'all, that's what I said. You don't know how to use the stones. This man now is way out of time. Roger. You are before Jamie. Meet Claire Time. Yeah, he ends up in either, I think he said it was 1935 or 1939 or 1940. He was doing some quick.

24:16 He was trying to do that math. It's him all night. Be like, OK, Jamie's at college, right? He's 18 or 19. That means, you know, because one Rodger already looks out of place because he's got the short hair. So he already looks out of place. But Brian Fraser, when he answers the door, and, you know, of course, Rogers in shock because he was like, he thought it was Mr. Murray. No, this is Brian Fraser. This is. Yeah. So he's sitting there trying to figure it out. And of course, Brian Fraser's looking at him like, dude, you OK? And he was like, oh, yeah, I'm so sorry. So my son has been taken by a man named Rob Cameron.

24:58 Have you seen him? And so he starts trying to recover himself. And all the time, one of the things about the episode, we're getting a lot of inner dialogue. So we're getting all of Roger's inner dialogue, which kind of threw me off because we don't really usually get Roger's inner voice. And at one point I was like, did he say that out loud or did he say in his head when he said Jenny, I didn't know. No, you didn't say it like Forrest Gump because. Because. We were Roger Ginny. This is where. Roger got in trouble last time. I need you to stop looking at these women a certain way when you be like, oh, I know you are. You know, to the point that the man had to say, my daughter already has. A boyfriend.

25:46 Well, not a boyfriend. She has a crush on somebody that's on, in, on in. But and then you had to say, oh, oh, I got it. You should have just said, oh, she looked like my sister. Instead you were like, oh, I got a wife. That make you even look worse because that means you've got a wife. But you're looking at this young. Girl, right, Right. I need him to stop when he comes in contact with a family member and he's just looking at him because he's just like, wow, he's in shock. Yeah, stop. Look at the floor. Look up at the sky, look to the right and look to the left, and then refocus yourself. But he was also, I think, and well, I know. That's the second time. No, I know. Time he got home.

26:27 No, actually that it's the third time, third time because don't forget about what's the name, the widow that he was building a cabin for even though he wasn't looking at her like that, but still he was spending a little. Yeah, that was, I would say that's him because he used the other one was a relative. And and he got caught up in that and he got home for that. OK. And this time around, you better be lucky that dad is nice and just said, honey, she has a crush. And clearly it's more than a crush when everybody know about it. Right. So Jenny goes to get Rodger. When when they're going out to Murray and Jim. My son's not here, so clearly they know who you come over here for. Right.

27:09 But OK, even with that 19391940 where they are right now, present day in 1778, that means you have loved this man for 40 years and now you are you are faced with the prospect of losing him. So I understand why she why she reacted the way she reacted to to Claire. But going back to Rodger and Lally Brock. So yeah, Rodger ends up in 19391940. I mean, 17391740, he does not know how he got there. He's like, did did Rob and Jim travel to the wrong time too? Like there's so many things that he now has to really figure out because technically speaking, Roger doesn't know anybody in this time. Nobody.

27:59 Nobody. Because he was trying to go 40 years ahead of where he ended up. How do you miscalculate by 40 years? You can't calculate. There is not a doubt on the stones that's. Something has to guide him we've talked about. But that was. Certain. People being magnets, right? And here's the thing. And what you're thinking and what? And you go to places for a reason. There is a purpose. That's sad. It's a purpose and a reason Jamie, not Jamie Claire end up where she was because of that magnet and it was a purpose for her to be there.

28:40 Her purpose, I hate to say it, her purpose is Jamie. So Roger purpose is his child. But if they are not, if they didn't travel through the stones, then he won't have anywhere to go, that is. True. Or. If he or I don't want to say if he, if he misdirected because you know one of the things about Roger's family, they have all these different Jeremiahs now if him and Buck both are thinking of Jeremiah when they're going through the stones. That can mess you. Up they could have been think they could have traveled back 40 years that could have been Buck's grandfather, great grandfather or something that they because you you have no way of no. Right.

29:32 That's what I'm saying so that so Jeremiah and Cameron could be anywhere, anytime they. Could be anywhere. I mean, they could, they really could be in 2000s. Let's see. That's what I'm saying. You we can't determine when Claire went back. Claire, when Claire went back and it was, you know, years later, she was just hoping that it will be the same amount of time. It was 20 years. But her heart again was saying I want to see him. So she was going to end up at any point.

30:12 She was going to see him. Yeah. I mean, her heart's desire. That was her, her main purpose, her heart's desire. That worked out right? But also they they do know that there is about a two. It's like anytime that Claire has traveled, it's always been 202 years. Exactly. So it's like when she was a player. It's not the same for everybody else. See, that's what my problems are. But we're going to leave it at that. So now he is. He's with. Family, even though they don't know. We don't know where Cameron is. We don't know where Cameron is, but and and. But they're doing the right thing asking everyone before you get on the ship to North Carolina. This is true too.

30:56 But the other thing too is we just talked about this when we discussed episode 8. You don't know what happens to your body when you go through the stones. And we definitely see that with Buck because when they first come through the stones, he's having heart issues, like almost like a heart attack or he's having an anxiety attack or something, but he has a hard time breathing. So they separate. Like I said, Buck goes to Inverness to check the ships. Rodger goes to Lally, Brock, Jenny while they while Brian and Rodger are out trying to find out if anybody has seen Rob or Jim, Jenny finds them and she says your kinsman William McKenzie has taken I'll on his way to Lally Brock. He asked for you to come.

31:49 So Buck is not doing good. And then they're like, OK, we don't have a healer in these parts, but there is a herbalist a ways away. So Roger's just kind of like, OK, well, I guess the herbalist is going to have to do because obviously Claire is not there yet. Because even when Claire went back, it was 1743. So they go into town, they knock on the door for the herbalist and I was sitting there looking 'cause I was looking at my peripheral, 'cause I wanted to see how Michelle was going to react when the door opened. And here is gave us Duncan.

32:33 So not only is it gave us Duncan in 1939, this is Buck's mother and Rodgers, what, 7 times great grandmother, but you. I was like, when I read this in the book, I was like, oh, this is going to be interesting. Now, I don't know if they're going to do exactly what they did in the show as in the book, but if they do, but. SPOILERS Does Buck know his mother? No, he doesn't know that. That's his mother. Who was he raised by? There was another Mackenzie family that had lost their child and so that's who Dougal gave the child to, OK gave Gaylis's baby to. So he was raised by Mackenzie still. So you can't say nothing because we need her to go her regular married way and continue all the shit she has done from here to there.

33:37 All I'm. Going to However, he's the only person who can really understand and guide you to what you need. To do they're not going to ask her nothing because we. Won. I know. I'm just saying she's the only person who would who actually knows. She actually knows what's happening and what to do. But you know, we can't talk. To her, yeah, but I mean, we don't know if she knows what's going on with him physically because as far as we know, she. Know, but she know about. Friendly, yeah, but she didn't have any issues traveling. So if they come in and they're like, oh, even if Rodger says hey, I know you're a trap, first of all, he can't have that conversation with her because then it's going to be like, how do you know what I am?

34:19 And it's going to be a whole. Bad question. She needs to continue on the path she's on. Right. And she didn't. But, but oh, wait, wait. But here's the thing. Galis Duncan met Rodger before she went through the stones in 1969, so this is not exactly a stranger coming to her door. But maybe she won't remember him like you meet people. Was he that did she RIP me like she mad twice? But did she meet him? Did she meet him enough for him to leave an impact? Or did she meet him 'cause she was at the college? You meet a lot of people. Yeah, but no, she specifically spoke to him and Brianna at the college, and then she saw them again at the pub.

35:03 Right, but still to remember what they look like. Forget it's probably because she's probably looked at Roger and was like, oh, he's attractive. Right not to be his great, great. No, because like I said, Roger now looks like he looks like he's from the future, but he's older, but he looks like I'm trying to call for Alice. She don't remember because he has the short. He has the short haircut. We're going to have to start a conversation about GAIL is after this recording because I have some. Questions. I'm just going to say it's going to be a very interesting ride from here. That's all I'm going to say. And what we have decided for this remainder of season 7. We will be watching the show together and then recording. So I'll be able to see all her reactions. We are recording our reactions.

35:57 If there's something that's like really funny, I'll post it, but I'm just at this point waiting to see what they're going to bring to the screen from the books because I finished reading the books for Dragon Con, so I'm kind of sort of in the know now. But of course they do make changes from page to screen. We've seen some of those changes. But I will say, even with what we saw in this particular episode, they did remain very close to the books. I think the only thing that was really different of note for me is the reason that Claire ends up going back to the States.

36:37 So what happens is Jamie and Claire are having a conversation. Jenny brings Claire some, you know, a letter that she's received. And apparently it's it's from Lord John. He's been trying to get letters to them, probably didn't know where they were after they left Fort Ticonderoga. But he's been trying to get letters to them because his nephew was injured in battle, has musket balls stuck in his stomach. None of the other physicians there are able to do it. And he's asking Claire to come and send to his nephew so that his nephew doesn't die. So the only issue that I have with that is, and we were talking about this, first of all, you left the Ridge over a year ago to try to come to Scotland.

37:24 You get detained because you're conscripted into into battle. So you spend the next year fighting the small battles that are leading up to the American Revolution. OK. You finally get leave to go home to Scotland. This is a month long journey. I think if I'm not mistaken, I remember them either referencing in the show or in the books that it's like a four month journey on C OK, so you got four months that you that it took you to get to Scotland. So this is a year and a almost a year and a half in the making of you leaving Fraser's Ridge to get to Scotland. You they probably have been in Scotland at this point, maybe a few weeks, if that.

38:09 And then all of a sudden you get this letter about this person who yes Lord John is dear to all of y'all. But is he? Is his nephew that you don't know dear enough for you to leave your dying brother-in-law to cut to make another four month journey home? And you? Is the nephew even going to be alive four months from then with two musket balls in his? Stomach so I am assuming I I have to assume this because stomach injuries are horrible and you you go fast with a stomach injury to be honest with you. So that he must have got shot where it really didn't bother his stomach. But he can't you better off traveling because at this point infection I mean like.

38:57 Unless the musket balls started in a place that wasn't as bad and because they haven't been able to get out, you know how sometimes things move around. Right. And that's what I'm thinking. Like it's not in a place that's causing damage, damage, but if it don't come out like he can't really move around. He can't. Like, yeah, something I'm thinking it's something like. That Yeah, Yeah. But the thing that kind of bothers me is because in the books, what prompts Claire to go back to the States and prompts this whole separation with Jamie because Jamie in this episode tells Claire he was like, OK, I can't leave in because Claire is like, well, we can't leave in.

39:39 Jamie says I can't but you can't, you can go home and save him. And Jenny also tells her if you can't save Ian but you can save this other person then you need to go and do this because of course that's probably what Ian would want her to do too. But in the books, Claire leaves because she gets a visit from Leary, who has received a letter from Marceline and Ori Christian, their their younger son at this point. The one who has, the one who has dwarfism, he has developed some type of infection or something is going on with his throat because of his condition that's making it harder and harder for him to breathe as he gets older.

40:25 So it's getting to the point where it's starting to endanger his life. And so Marshall is like my pleas for the love you bear your grandchildren. Please go to Claire and ask her to come home so that she can operate on Ori Christian. So that's what happens in the book. Leary goes to Claire and basically says for our grandchild, will you please go? Will you please go take care of it? That is the only thing I can see Claire leaving a dying in for. And then I think what happens is once she gets there, she is the the information about Laura John's nephew is brought to her attention and then she takes care of it, but she goes home for Orry Christian. So that was that's kind of weird for me in the show because I don't think that Claire would leave in at this point, especially having been gone for so light at this point. They when they left to go get the. The French gold from Silky Island and Ian was kidnapped. This has been almost 10 years now that they've been gone. So I, I just, I think I, I do believe she would do it for Lord John to be honest with you and for his family because of what he has done for her family.

41:44 It's just that I don't like the reason like a bullet because by the time I get there, he may be dead. Like if you came up with something else that he would need surgery and he know Claire can do the surgery. I was OK because she still would have went because it was Lord John's family. It's important. So I just don't like the. You know, like what? How they have, he has a a stomach, he can't travel and all that stuff. Yeah. So that's the only thing. So it would have been better with, you know, Marcy's baby. But whatever, we'll go with it.

42:24 Claire's on her way back to her. Way the young age who has to confess his love 'cause his family says you didn't tell her you loved her you didn't gave her a dog right that's not the same I'm. Like but it but. The but it was the same. But Bug had to tell her that though. So like she didn't really know now, but she knew. But he needs to go get. He needs to go get this woman. He was going to try to send a letter with Claire to tell Rachel. I don't know how long I'll be gone. I can't ask you away from me. His mother tore that letter up. It was like you need. To stay here, we, we, we're good. But the thing that kind of, I won't say necessarily convinced him, but the conversation that they have, she takes him to the graveyard.

43:09 And The thing is at the beginning of the episode, you know, they always show you a little scene that kind of relates to the episode. So they showed a gravestone and all you can see what was ISA and I was like is that Ishabel's grave. And then you see Jimmy clearing it off because of course, the the gravestone is kind of covered with grass and Moss and everything. So it's current day. So at some point before Jimmy disappeared, you know, he probably went to the graveyard and saw it because we know that they go to the graveyard sometimes. He said that's that's how they feel close to granddad. And I was just like, that's a grave for Ishabel. And then I was like, wait, did they did, did they do that in Scotland?

43:53 And that's exactly what they did. Jenny had one made, they had Ishabel's name on it. And then they had the words for Beloved daughter written in Mohawk engraved. And this is where she tells him, you know, it's it's so that he can have a place to feel close to her, to visit her whenever he's there. And she was like, just like, she's always with you. You are always with us. Go to your young last. You can live with your Auntie Claire. And he says, I got to stay with dad for the rest of his life. And she was like, no, your dad wants you to go and live the rest of yours. And you need to go tell that girl you love her right before she before she starts dating William. I'm just joking.

44:39 She's not. Not if Michelle got anything to say. Well, no, but I mean, I know they tried to do the little love triangle, but you can tell like, she really is really, really fond of Ian. So yeah, yeah, He just needs to confess his confess his love. However, the bug issue needs to be exterminated. But see, if she wouldn't go with William, then the bug issue wouldn't even be a issue. It won't be, but then you won't have anybody for anybody for life. He needs somebody. And that's not, that's not exactly true because even if Rachel ended up with William, he still knows that Ian loves Rachel. So he will probably probably go after him. So but but yeah, also I think with with Ian, I think it's enough for him that they came and he was able to see him want his son to sit sitting there and lose and watch him die.

45:33 And lose the lose a love after he has already been through. Even even with even not even thinking about Rachel or not even bringing her into it, he doesn't want Ian to sit there and watch him slowly wither away. Not only because of just the fact that you just don't want somebody to sit there and watch you die, but also Ian. We saw it in this episode. He would have a lot of guilt about it. Right, but his dad would be OK with him being there, but he don't want him to be there. And you're holding like you left your life on pause. It can be different if you had nothing going on. We can talk about your adventures, you know, with everything, but you literally have your life on pause.

46:15 Like you. You can have a family. Yeah. So I do need you to go 'cause time is short so you need to get going. Yeah, I'm glad that he did tell Ian about Swift is of lizards though. Yeah, I do. He did tell his dad that he has a son now I just. Need him to tell Jimmy. Yeah. And I think he probably did. We just didn't see that. I'm really thinking that that was all you think, but it's going to be later. I think it's going to be later, but I'm just I'm I'm he needs to tell her. But I'm glad he told Ian because again, he's going back to America now with Claire. He probably won't have that opportunity. And the fact that he was able to say that to his father's face, like, and sit down face to face, give him the name, give him the context.

46:59 And was like, yeah, tell him about his his Christian name, Ian James. Yeah. I just, this episode was so emotional and I was just like, I feel like Claire's time in Scotland was too short. But again, like I said, there's so much story. Yeah, they, they don't have time for that. Sorry. So. We have a season and 1/2. I know and Jamie is still there, so we will still get to see some some. Scotland content, right? We will. And we're gateless too, you know, so. OK, but you know if we see and gave us now, that means we will also see Dougal because we do know that Graham Mctavish came back for the back half of season 7.

47:47 Now I thought originally it was going to be like just flashbacks before I read before I read the books. But no, Roger ended up way. Back. I'm out of time. Just Allison. Like he went further back then Claire. Went right, that's what I'm saying this is like that's what I'm saying before you think Claire even got there right, like way before this is I'm so mad. It's like 3-4 years so. Yeah, it's, it's going to be. Interesting. And that's why I say when you come back, let's just say everything gets resolved at home and you come back and you're like, well, what year is this? You're like Brianna said. You know what, honey?

48:29 It's been about 5I. Don't think that would happen. No, but I'm just saying that could happen. I know I'm coming up with scenarios. It's been about five years. It's been five years. I'm psyched. Yeah. I mean, we made it work. We knew you'll come back, but you know when you will come. Back. But here's the other thing too. So we were talking about this in the last episode. Let's say Roger isn't able to get back if he's stuck in 1939 or whatever, if Brianna decides to go back to find him and Jim if Jim is even in this time. What time would she go? Back right because she doesn't know that he went no. That's what I'm saying. There's no phone call, no e-mail, no text messages.

49:10 You do one person do need to stay put. But that person who is staying put in waiting you, we don't know when it is. And no, she's not going to be remarried. Or absolutely not. Wait, wait a minute. No, wait a second. No, she OK. We'll talk about that off. Oh Lord, no, she ain't. She ain't. I don't know, but I'm just saying if it's like 10 years that he still didn't come back. No, OK, she's not going to do it because look, she she has the example. She saw what happened with her dad. Her dad thought her mom was gone, never to see her again. He got married again. She's probably like she'll do some. She'll go to the library and do some research and see if she ever finds. She, I don't think she would do that. I don't think she would do that. No, I said go and do research to see if his name is out. There.

49:54 Oh, to see if Rodger's name is out there for 10 years. No, she. OK, let's try this, everyone. No, she's not going to remarry, but she will give her a side piece. All right? OK, That's all I'm saying, but my whole point. Is we don't. Know we don't know when they're traveling in the all this time. So that's all I'm trying to say. I'm just saying, Jamie, you know, Claire was gone for 20 years and Jamie only did it with Geneva Dunsani. And that was, that was. Asked. Of him. Right, right. Mary McNab. And then, however, if he ever consummated with Larry or whatever.

50:38 But yeah, Jamie was pretty much a monk the whole 20 years that Claire was gone. And Claire? Pretty much was too, yeah, to be honest with you. So, you know, she had a husband. She was just thinking of another man when she was with her husband so. I mean, but. Nice clothes. You never used to do that before. I'm like, who wants to sit there and be kissing and just looking all in your face and. She wasn't even trying to open the eyes. Because. Because when you open your eyes, you're going to see Blackjack Randall. When she open her eyes, it's just not who she going to be with. We'll be terrible. It's just just. But I'm just. Saying the more immediate reaction if I'm kissing you and you look like this man who tortured me and my husband. But still she she's able to put peace, put that apart and compartmentalize that she still and she that's why she should never get mad when he had he had affairs. That's a whole other conversation. OK, that's another off.

51:40 Which that's a whole other conversation. Remember, we are going to at some point do a what Frank knew and we're going to talk about book Frank, but she needs to read the books first before we can talk about. What Frank knew. OK, but you know. So we got we got break. Frank knew. He, you know, he, Frank knew someone didn't love him, but that's that he. We can hate on Frank, but Frank had to be married to someone who just didn't just like Leary. I. Know who just did not have a place for him. OK, I know. OK, I'm just saying whatever. OK so however they they're getting back to they can go to America.

52:21 Yep. Claire's going. Back to America. And when I say the previews for the next episode are kind of like, I can't wait to see your face when certain things come into play if they stick to the way it's written in the books. But like I said, they they seem to have been very faithful to the to the books. At some point they are going to have to diverge because they're only giving us one more season because book 10 has not been out. It is not out yet and probably won't be out for another two or three years. They're going to have to diverge from some stuff. They do, and then they got to give us an ending that is. Not the notebook, no. I'm going to say general enough where it's not going to be the same as with how the books end, right? But a good ending for this fan just has to be a good ending for you, right?

53:17 And to honestly, a good ending now is dying. But I'm not being funny right now. A good ending is just just a stopping point and like the stopping point where we know that they would be OK, like they're out of war. Yeah, issues. Good point. Jamie is going to like, like them. We know that right now they are living in the cabin. She's working on the herbs and her new book and he's out just building her home and that they just living and sitting on the porch and and thinking of their grandkids like, that's the ending. Yeah. And we know, OK, they're OK.

53:58 They're going to be OK. And at some point one of them will pass away, maybe together, maybe separate. Yeah, yeah. So I don't know, I think the next few episodes are going to be very interesting. I think the story is going to move fairly quickly because they do have a lot we do. And we were talking about this. We are so sick of the war stuff, but they got more battles to come, so we're going to see some more fighting. But like I was about to say, at some point Jamie is going to be too old for them to keep calling him because he's with probably 50 he. Should just say I can't see like. I I mean.

54:42 I'm old, right? And in the book he said he had he missing a finger. Just be like I'm missing a finger. I can't do nothing. Yeah, I mean, he's still functional. That's the one thing about. He needs to act like he's not functional. That's the problem. He run around like he in his 20s and he's not. Right. He needs to be like, look, I'm too old for this shit. He needs to be like he needs. To be looking like Ian right now, just be like, I can't go to war. Not looking like, oh, I'm a good sniper. I can, you know, run across the field and like stab like 30 people at one time. No, you can't do that, right? Oh my gosh.

55:25 She's looking at this in the background, the ending where Roger they're going to visit the her herbalist and she was like when she watched the episode, she was like, oh shit. And see, here he go again for the next time, looking at her like I know you, I know you. But at this point she knows him as well. I'm I'm still thinking about. That I'm gonna answer this question, you know. She I'm still thinking about it, she because she met him before she went through the stones and she went through the stones and landed in the 30s like she's at the house. I think she this is probably right either right before she met Arthur and married him. I think that's where where she is in the story, if I remember correctly.

56:15 So it wouldn't have been that long ago that she met Rodger and Brianna in 1969. OK. All right, so we will see. Did we touch on everything for this first episode? I think we did. We did a lot of crying in this episode. We were just sitting there with our tissues, like and anger. Yes, I know it'll get better. It'll get better. I mean, when you see the way they pull the story, if they follow the books, when you see the way they pull the story, I think you're going to like what they did. I will say that I think you, I think you're going to enjoy what happens in this back half of season 7, even though there will be some, there will be some heartbreak because of course, obviously if they're telling us that BN is sick, obviously we're going to get his death in the in the season.

57:13 I don't I mean, even Claire says she doesn't think he has long. So we're going to get some heartbreak, but there's also good some really good stuff that's going to happen. OK, I trust you. I think he's going to be. I think he's going to be. I trust you. OK, I will. So, so I guess on that note, that's it for our show. You can find us online at www.phantomhybrid.com. We are on social media, on all the social media at Phantom Hybrid. You can chat with us on our Discord channel. You can watch our videos on our YouTube channel, and you can listen to us on all major podcast streaming platforms. Thanks for listening. We'll be joining the conversation next time.